'Listen to us.’ What These 12 Kids Want Adults to Know. (Opinion: America in Focus)

Author: Ariel Kaminer and Adrian J. Rivera

Rivera, Adrian J., and Ariel Kaminer. “'Listen to Us.' What These 12 Kids Want Adults to Know.” The New York Times, The New York Times, 21 Mar. 2023, https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2023/03/21/opinion/teen-youth-focus-group.html.

Ms. Kaminer is a deputy Op-Ed editor. Mr. Rivera is an editorial assistant in Opinion.

The best thing about being my age is: blank.

Those complicated years from seventh to ninth grade are both a time of rapid change for many kids and a subject of enduring bewilderment for many adults. From concerns about social media to studies about mental health to the effects of Covid school closures and beyond, the lives of tweens are a topic of much fascination and worry. But tweens themselves are often absent from the discussion.

We invited 12 kids ages 11 to 14 to tell us about how things look from their vantage. Over a couple of hours, the participants in this focus group, who live in states across the country, shared their views on school, family, recreation and their goals.

They like being kids; being an adult seems stressful, particularly when it comes to paying the bills. “Your childhood is something you’ll never get back,” Trinity, one of the participants, said. “And I feel like you’re an adult for a long time, way longer than your childhood. You can be more creative and more curious about the world when you’re younger.”

They find it easier to be themselves online than IRL, though it’s also easier to be mean. They have gender-expansive peers and don’t think much of it. Yes, they love their phones. No, they don’t really see what all the stress is about.

And what message would they like to send to adults? “Listen to us,” said Wynter, another participant.

Fill in the blank for me. The best thing about being my age is: blank.

If you could wave a magic wand and turn into an adult, would you?

Andrew, 11

I would rather be my current age, because I don’t really have to worry about everything that adults have to worry about. They have to pay their rent and feed their kids, but I just have to do, really, nothing.

Trinity, 12

I’d be my current age, because your childhood is something you’ll never get back. And I feel like you’re an adult for a long time, way longer than your childhood. You can be more creative and more curious about the world when you’re younger.

Nate, 14

Being an adult, you have to go to a job every day and work. And then you have to spend the money on the rent and food and all that stuff.

Sophie, 13

I’m going to be my current age, because then the amount of responsibilities I have doesn’t change.

Roshini, 14

I’d rather be an adult just because there’s more flexibility and freedom. Kind of on your own schedule — you can do anything you want. And you make money.

Moderator, Margie Omero

What do you like best about school these days?

Te’Kai, 11

My math teacher, who’s trying to help me be better at math.

Kira, 14

Being able to see my friends.

Jonah, 12

Science. You can create fun stuff.

Wynter, 14

Lunch. The food’s good.

Moderator, Margie Omero

What do you like least about school? If you were the principal of your school and you could change anything, what would you change?

Nate, 14

Homework.

Moderator, Margie Omero

You said earlier that you felt like you were getting better at doing homework.

Nate, 14

I would still cancel homework, because I still don’t like it.

Moderator, Margie Omero

[Laughs] Fair enough. What else would people change?

Sophie, 13

I would love to use our phones in class. Sometimes people just want to text or watch something quickly.

Trinity, 12

My school gives out a lot of homework, and my math teacher is just really strict. You have a test every, like, Friday. So it kind of ruins the Friday fun, you know.

Wynter, 14

I feel like you’re just trapped inside of this building for eight hours a day. And they just teach you a bunch of stuff you don’t know, and they just yell at you when you make a small mistake. They’re just preparing you to be yelled at and not know stuff when you get out of school.

Trinity, 12

I feel like my school is teaching me how to be responsible. At the beginning of the year, they give you computers and folders and all this stuff for school supplies. And if you lose it, they don’t give you another one.

Moderator, Ariel Kaminer

Many of you went to school at least partly online because of Covid. What was good about that, and what was difficult about that?

Wynter, 14

I only did a couple of weeks online at the beginning of the year when we were required. But, I mean, it was chill just to be on the screen and do whatever you want.

Hunter, 14

I did two years online. The only good part about it was that I could stay home. But for me, I needed someone to be there to teach me, instead of just reading.

Andrew, 11

It didn’t really feel like school because I just woke up and then, like, 10 minutes later, I was in the classroom. And I feel like they didn’t really teach me anything. There was just too much distraction

Moderator, Ariel Kaminer

Do you feel that online school during Covid changed how you think or feel about school now?

Trinity, 12

I think it made me see how organized my school is. Because when we had Covid, it was chaotic. We went through Covid for the last two months of fourth grade and the first two months of fifth grade. There was a lot of plastic. We were protected. We had to eat outside. It made me see that they care about us and stuff.

Jilian, 14

Online school is very different from in-person school. It was really hard to focus online. It didn’t really feel like I was able to learn as well as when I was in person.

Roshini, 14

I also felt really distracted and wasn’t able to focus when I was at home. I was able to focus a lot more in person.

Moderator, Ariel Kaminer

One last question about schools before we move on. Other than fire drills, have you guys ever had the kind of drill at school that’s meant to protect you from any kind of emergency? How do those make you feel, and how prepared do you feel now?

Jonah, 12

I was scared. But it protects you a lot.

Wynter, 14

Those drills just happen. I’m prepared if something happens.

Moderator, Ariel Kaminer

Are these drills for a particular emergency?

Wynter, 14

Like active assailants or weather emergencies, stuff like that.

Andrew, 11

We have code-red drills a lot, and our teacher always stands by the door. But we had one where the teacher didn’t know it was just a drill. And so seeing my teacher hide behind the desk made me feel a little like they’re not really going to do anything if there’s actually a person in the school.

Moderator, Ariel Kaminer

And Trinity?

Trinity, 12

I feel like the drill isn’t as accurate and as serious as if it actually happened. A drill, they have to practice it. But if it actually happened, it would be chaotic, and people would be really scared.

Moderator, Margie Omero

Let’s talk a bit about screens, phones, social media. Tell me a little bit how much time you’re typically on a screen during the school day. Not for something like a school assignment but for your own use.

Jilian, 14

My school’s not really that strict about being on your phones. It really depends on the teacher. But sometimes in class, we’re not really doing anything, so I might get to spend part of the class on my phone. Usually, I’ll just text my friends or play games or watch a show or TikTok, something like that.

Moderator, Margie Omero

Everybody here has their own cellphone. What kinds of things are you doing at school when you’re on your phone?

Kira, 14

I don’t really go on my phone at school, but when I’m on my own computer, I write my book. I’m writing a book.

Moderator, Margie Omero

Is it fiction or nonfiction?

Kira, 14

It’s fiction.

Moderator, Margie Omero

Nice. Roshini, what are you doing on your phone or device during the day?

Roshini, 14

Usually just texting my friends or on social media.

Moderator, Margie Omero

Let’s talk about phone usage at home, after school.

About how much time do you spend on your phone at home, after school?

Andrew, 11

I’m usually on my phone for an hour when I get back from school. I just watch stuff and text my friends. Since they all live in my neighborhood, I usually see who can play outside, and then we go play outside.

Sophie, 13

I’m watching TikTok.

Moderator, Margie Omero

Is there a social media platform you can’t live without?

Wynter, 14

Mainly TikTok.

Hunter, 14

An app called Discord, because most of my friends use it.

Jonah, 12

YouTube.

Hunter, 14

I’m more talkative and more friendly. I try to be friends with more people online.

Moderator, Ariel Kaminer

Why are you more talkative online?

Hunter, 14

Because the games I play are team games, I have to communicate.

Matthew, 13

I talk a lot more online than I do in real life for the same reason. I play team games.

Trinity, 12

I’m more myself when I’m online. In school I feel like you’re just being watched by teachers. You can’t do as much stuff as you would do at home. With my friends, whether I’m FaceTiming them or playing them, I feel like I’m, like, a better person, a more fun person when I’m with them.

Nate, 14

Online feels more peaceful and calming. You don’t have to talk with anybody in person or do anything in person. You’re just sitting on your bed or chair, watching or doing something.

Andrew, 11

When I’m online, I can mute myself, and they can’t really see me. I can’t just mute myself in real life.

Moderator, Margie Omero

Sometimes when I talk to folks your age, they say that they’re seeing things online about what’s happening in politics or their local government or in other countries or in the environment. Is anybody following or seeing stuff like this online?

Jilian, 14

I don’t know if I’d say I really follow it, but on Instagram or Tiktok, I hear stuff about elections and the war with Ukraine and Russia.

Jilian, 14

I don’t think it’s the most reliable source. I feel like you should actually Google these things and go on verified websites instead.

Roshini, 14

I do see a lot of stuff on social media, but I don’t follow it. But I do think it sometimes can have a negative impact.

Moderator, Margie Omero

Tell me what you mean.

Roshini, 14

Not on me personally, but I feel like with other people — people have their own opinions on everything.

Wynter, 14

Every now and then, I hear something about the environment or politics. But I don’t really follow up on it, unless it’s something like, “Oh, that’s kind of cool.” I saw something about the Willow Project, the oil development plan in Alaska, and there was a petition online to stop it.

Moderator, Ariel Kaminer

A lot of adults are worried about the amount of time that kids spend online. What do you think about that concern? Is that a legitimate concern to have about kids?

Trinity, 12

I don’t think it should be a concern. For most kids, they go on their phone to talk with their friends or hang out with their friends. Because some kids have friends that don’t go to their school, so they can’t talk with them all the time in person. I feel like people use it to communicate with their friends

Moderator, Ariel Kaminer

And what about in terms of the amount of time? Should parents be concerned about the total amount of time?

Trinity, 12

I think maybe a little bit, but it really depends who you are. Every person’s different.

Jilian, 14

I do think it is a legitimate concern, especially screen time. There’s so many other things that you could be doing besides just being on your phones all the time.

Roshini, 14

I think parents have a right to be concerned. Like I mentioned before, social media does have a negative impact in some ways, depending on what content your child is seeing.

Moderator, Ariel Kaminer

Have your parents put any kinds of restrictions on the amount of screen time you have?

Sophie, 13

Sometimes my mother would take my phone away at a certain time so that I wasn’t on my phone when I was supposed to be asleep.

Nate, 14

Not much. It just really all depends, like if it’s a school night and I’m staying up too late and doing it.

Moderator, Margie Omero

A few people said that their parents set some rules sometimes or they’ll take the phone away at night or try to have some sort of cutoff. Do people feel like that’s a good thing?

Trinity, 12

I think it’s worth it, because then I can get at least another hour or two of sleep more than I usually do.

Andrew, 11

I haven’t really had this happen, but if I get a bad grade, then they’ll take it away. They know that I usually do that instead of doing my homework. That really helps me out because then I would actually have to focus on doing my work so I could get smarter.

Moderator, Margie Omero

Are people’s parents tracking what they do online? Does anybody have that kind of experience where they feel like their parents are really kind of trying to infiltrate what they’re doing online?

Trinity, 12

Yeah, sometimes they do. They don’t ask me every day. But sometimes they do, just to know that I’m safe and to remind me that I shouldn’t talk to any random people or strangers online.

Moderator, Ariel Kaminer

Have people had scary or upsetting experiences online?

Trinity, 12

Cyberbullying. It was somebody from my school.

Roshini, 14

Yeah, not personally me, but I know cyberbullying happens in my school. People make fake accounts to kind of lure them into it.

Moderator, Ariel Kaminer

And how do you think that online bullying compares to in-person bullying? Is it more likely to happen online or less likely?

Roshini, 14

I think it’s more likely to happen online, just because you’re behind a screen and no one really knows who you are. And they can say a lot of hurtful things.

Hunter, 14

I wouldn’t count this as cyberbullying, but this kid did something extremely weird at my school. There’s a video of him doing it. I won’t say what it was, but everyone just started making fun of him because of it.

Moderator, Ariel Kaminer

Do you think it’s easier to be mean online or in person?

Hunter, 14

I’m pretty sure that being mean online is actually easier. You don’t know the person, and they don’t know you.

Moderator, Margie Omero

I want to talk a little bit about feeling stressed out or anxious. Who here feels stressed out or anxious, and what are you stressed out or anxious about?

Te’Kai, 11

Something that stresses me out is always having to go to each class and the time I have to spend there.

Kira, 14

The amount of work and how much time I have to do it.

Jilian, 14

I sometimes get stressed out about schoolwork.

Wynter, 14

Schoolwork, mainly. Sports sometimes.

Trinity, 12

School and sports and our environment, I guess.

Moderator, Margie Omero

What stresses you out about the environment?

Trinity, 12

On the news and stuff, I’ve heard about global warming and pollution and people littering.

Moderator, Margie Omero

Do other people get stressed out about the environment?

Roshini, 14

Whenever a natural disaster happens, I just think worst-case scenario. There are a lot of hurricanes on the coast where I live.

Moderator, Margie Omero

If somebody came to you, a friend of yours, and said, “I’m feeling really anxious. I’m feeling really stressed out,” what would you say to them?

Andrew, 11

I would just ask them what they’re stressed out about and try to help them out with it.

Jilian, 14

I feel like I would try to talk them through it and see if I can help them solve the problem.

Te’Kai, 11

I’d tell him to talk to their parents.

Wynter, 14

If it was something I could help them with, like school or something, I’d try and help them study. Or I’d try and give them advice.

Moderator, Ariel Kaminer

Here’s a general question: Do you guys know folks your age who identify as nonbinary or trans? Anybody in your school or class?

Roshini, 14

Yeah, I have a couple of friends who are in that category.

Moderator, Ariel Kaminer

Does it change anything in school or with friends for somebody to identify themselves as nonbinary or trans?

Roshini, 14

For me, I don’t think so, because their identity — they’re a very human being, like anyone else. I don’t think they should be judged for how they identify themselves.

Moderator, Ariel Kaminer

Is that how it plays out at school?

Roshini, 14

No, I don’t think so. I know there’s been times where people have been judged for it.

Moderator, Ariel Kaminer

Judged how?

Roshini, 14

I don’t want to say the words, but people say words to their face that are really hurtful.

Trinity, 12

My middle school is small. The people who go to my school that are nonbinary or transgender —

Moderator, Ariel Kaminer

And for them to identify themselves that way, does that change anything for them in school or with friends?

Trinity, 12

I don’t think it’s different or it should be different. Because, like Roshini said, like, they’re a human being, so they should be treated the same way. I mean, some people would judge them, but I don’t know.

Moderator, Margie Omero

I want folks to tell me a little bit about what they think they might want to do when they grow up. I don’t necessarily mean a job but, like, where you want to live or what you want your family to look like and what sort of hopes and dreams you might have for yourself.

Jonah, 12

I want to become an N.B.A. player.

Sophie, 13

Maybe a translator?

Moderator, Margie Omero

A translator? What kind of language?

Sophie, 13

French.

Moderator, Margie Omero

And so where do you see yourself?

Sophie, 13

Anywhere.

Nate, 14

I just want a nice job with a nice amount of money and a nice car and a nice house and stuff like that.

Andrew, 11

I want to make it to the N.B.A. or the M.L.B. or some American sports program or something like that.

Moderator, Margie Omero

Do you see yourself, like, living in a certain part of the country?

Andrew, 11

Beverly Hills.

Te’Kai, 11

I want to become a YouTuber and have a nice channel.

Kira, 14

I’d like to maybe have a job that supports me financially and maybe have a little bit of extra money and live with my best friend.

Moderator, Margie Omero

Here’s a question: What makes you nervous or scared about getting older, about growing up?

Jilian, 14

I’m scared about finances. You have to pay for college and then a house. There’s just a lot of expenses.

Wynter, 14

I’m scared of the possibility of losing my job and not having a stable income to get a house or apartment to live in.

Andrew, 11

I’m scared of getting too caught up in work and separating from people that I care about.

Matthew, 13

I’m scared of failing in whatever my job is and not having money.

Jonah, 12

I’m not really scared of anything.

Moderator, Ariel Kaminer

How do you imagine the world might be different when you are adults?

Wynter, 14

Nothing will probably be actually different, but the way you view it will be different. Now you see a house and you’re like, “Oh, my gosh, I want to live there. That’s so nice.” And then when you grow up, you’re like, “That’s a lot of planning. That’s too big.”

Hunter, 14

Prices will be going up, but salary and stuff like that would be going up, too.

Nate, 14

I think the world might get better, because of new things and new technology.

Moderator, Ariel Kaminer

Do you have any guesses of how that technology might help us or hurt us, or what it would do? What kind of technology?

Nate, 14

Probably help us travel and stuff.

Moderator, Ariel Kaminer

How much impact do you think that kids like you can have on the world around them and the path that it takes?

Matthew, 13

I feel like kids my age can’t really have a big impact on the world, because most adults nowadays don’t listen to kids.

Trinity, 12

Adults are not listening to kids. They’re like, “They’re just kids. They don’t know anything.”

Moderator, Margie Omero

Is there a message that you want to send to adults?

Wynter, 14

Listen to us.

Moderator, Margie Omero

Let’s say you could ask your 25-year-old self a question. What would you ask, and how would you answer?

Jonah, 12

Is your life better?

Moderator, Margie Omero

What do you think 25-year-old Jonah would say?

Jonah, 12

A lot better.

Moderator, Margie Omero

Better in what way?

Jonah, 12

Like, I’ve accomplished my dream or something.

Matthew, 13

I’d ask myself if my relationships, my friendships are still the same.

Moderator, Margie Omero

And what do you think your 25-year-old self would say?

Matthew, 13

I think they’d still say that it’s pretty much still the same.

Jilian, 14

I’d probably ask myself what I’m doing with my career and about my friends and my family. I want to become a medical illustrator, so I do hope I do that. And I do want to have cats and dogs.

Andrew, 11

I would ask myself if I’m in the M.L.B. or the N.B.A.

Kira, 14

I would ask about my friend and how her life is going and how things have changed, like, around the world.

Moderator, Margie Omero

And what do you think your 25-year-old self would say?

Kira, 14

I would hope that my friend is doing better, and I think that the world might have changed a lot, since so many years have passed. There’s probably going to be more pollution and a lot more technology.

Sophie, 13

I would ask what I’m doing, like if I’m making money and if I have a job.

Wynter, 14

I’d want to know how far I made it into volleyball.

Moderator, Margie Omero

What do you think your 25-year-old self would say?

Wynter, 14

Hopefully, I played in college.

Roshini, 14

I would ask 25-year-old me, are you proud of me? Because I feel like at 25, I should be in a good spot where I’m pretty accomplished, hopefully.

Moderator, Margie Omero

OK. Nate, how about you?

Nate, 14

How did you get so old?

America in Focus seeks to hear and understand the views of cross-sections of Americans whose voices are often not heard in opinion journalism.

This discussion was moderated by a focus group veteran, Margie Omero, and Ariel Kaminer, a New York Times deputy Op-Ed editor. Ms. Omero has done similar work over the years for Democratic candidates and partisan groups. She chose the participants and obtained their guardians’ consent. (Times Opinion paid her for the work.) This transcript has been edited for length and clarity; an audio recording of the session is also included. Participants provided their biographical details. As is customary in focus groups, our role as moderators was not to argue with or fact-check the speakers, and some participants expressed opinions not rooted in facts

Illustrations by Lucinda Rogers.

DMU Timestamp: March 17, 2023 08:51