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Which is more helpful, honest, and harmless?
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What effect does nature have on Frankenstein?
What effect does it have on the monster?
In what ways are these effects similar/different?
What might Mary Shelley's message about nature be?
Feel free to mention romanticism and industrialism in your response.
What surpised you about the monster when he and Victor meet on the mountain?
How does Victor react to the monster?
How does this influence your impression of Victor?
Given the way the monster acts, do you think he killed William?
If so, how do you reoncile that fact with his current temperment?
Do you believe Victor is to blame for the monster's current emotional state?
JACKSON GENTGES(Feb 07 2019 2:35PM):
Mary Shelly believes that nature can give someone solitude and peace withing themselves.
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Throughout the novel so far, nature is used as a rehabilitation point. For example on page 66, “It filled me with a sublime ecstasy, that gave wings to the soul, and allowed it to soar from the obscure world to light and joy. The sight of the awful and majestic in nature had indeed always the effect of solemnizing my mind and causing me to forget the passing cares of life” (Shelly). This illuminates the fact that Mary Shelly believes that nature “solemnizes the mind” (Shelly). In all of the chaos that is occurring in Dr. Frankenstein’s life, he finds peace in nature.
JOHN MYERS(Feb 07 2019 7:04PM):
I agree with this statement however, there are a few things that I don't agree with.
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I agree with the fact that Frankenstein has something to do with the monster’s state of mind, however, I do believe the monster’s action also have to do with his state of mind, possibly because of the guilt that he has to deal with after killing his creator’s brother.
JADE CIEZAK(Feb 07 2019 2:32PM):
that nature heals him
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On page 66, Frenkinstein claims, “They elevated me from all littleness of feeling..” Victor found peace and comfort in nature while on his journey. The effect that environment can heal a person in any form of illness it may have. It may not cure them, but it distracts the individual of the pain and sadness that they feel.
ELLA BEU(Feb 07 2019 2:46PM):
I agree with you.
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I think that nature does make Victor find comfort because it is not only healing him but it is giving him a chance to forget about what has happened for a while.
ELLA BEU(Feb 07 2019 2:33PM):
Nature makes Frakenstein calm and its a place where he forgets about everything going on in his life.
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“The sight of the awful and majestic in mature had indeed always the effect of solemnising my mind and causing me to forget the passing cares of life” (66). This quote shows that because Victor was living with the guilt of being the cause of William’s murder he went to nature to forget about it all for a while.
William Stastny(Feb 07 2019 2:36PM):
Is this a healthy thing to do?
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What might happen to Victor’s family when he runs away into the woods? How have they reacted in the past when he has “disappeared”? What does this say about Victor and his relationship with his family?
Frankenstein has always loved the changing of the seasons and nature in general. Even after finding about the death of his own brother, nature still managed to cheer him up. “It was a divine spring; and the seasons contributed greatly to my convalescence” (Shelley 39). Here, he clearly states that the spring time cheered him up from that tragic event.
William Stastny(Feb 07 2019 2:38PM):
Excellent observation.
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Victor might be a bit of a weirdo. With that in mind, where do other people look for comfort during challenging times? Why doesn’t Victor do the same? What message might this be sending about a pretty important idea?
AMANDA DROZT(Feb 07 2019 2:48PM):
I agree with your statement about how Frankenstein feels about nature.
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Throughout the text it seems that Frankenstein has always loved nature and he has always seen it to be peaceful and a place to just relax. I think your comment and evidence summarized his true feelings about nature around him nicely.
NATHAN LAFEVER(Feb 07 2019 3:09PM):
I completely agree with what you are saying on how he is at peace with nature.
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When he is in nature he seems to feel more inspired by all that is around him. It also caused him to forget the passing cares of his life, so he felt at peace in nature and when he was in nature he was no longer lonely.
JACK LEE(Feb 07 2019 2:47PM):
Frankenstein is affected by nature in a huge way
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This is true because when victor tried to create something that was unnatural that is a living thing, nature responded by giving him a monster. Once the monster became a part of nature, Frankenstein decided to neglect it and keep it away, so nature further punishes him and makes the monster affect is life even after neglecting it, William dies, Justine is executed because she is accused of his murder and so forth.
I agree with this statement because Frankenstein does try to ignore the the unnatural(the monster) rather than doing something about him, so then nature or the natural way life goes affects Frankenstein negatively by harming his family.
KYLEE MCMULLIN(Feb 07 2019 2:49PM):
I think that nature calms Victor and offers him an escape from what has happened in his life.
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I think that nature calms Victor and offers him an escape from what has happened in his life. While In nature he says that the scenes gave him the “greatest consolation” that he was “capable of receiving”
William Stastny(Feb 07 2019 2:26PM):
Shelley believes nature can heal people.
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This is true when you look at Chapter whatever and see Victor go to Chamonix for refuge. He remarks how great he feels when he says, “QUOTE” (Shelley Whatever).
Nature is a place of peace so I think Shelley is trying to convey the message that nature can help people get over things and not let it weigh them down so much.
JACK LEE(Feb 07 2019 2:58PM):
Mary Shelley believes that nature is something be can be healed by
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This is very true because on page 66, (talking about nature) It says .."that gathered around me and bade me be at peace.” This shows that Shelley thinks nature is a place for peace and away from your troubles.
MADISON DENNIS(Feb 07 2019 2:34PM):
surprised
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I was surprised when the monster didn’t act violent or try to do something to Victor when he ran at him because Victor describes him as an awful creature but if he was as awful as we think he is then he could’ve just killed him instead of telling Victor to “Be calm!”
ANNA SIEGWALD(Feb 07 2019 2:59PM):
That surprised me too.
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You picture this big, ugly creature and you would imagine that he would be mean. Instead, the monster took the situation in a way that was very shocking.
KYLEE MCMULLIN(Feb 07 2019 2:37PM):
It surprised me that the monster was very intelligent and seems to feel things very deeply,
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It surprised me that the monster was very intelligent and seems to feel things very deeply, in a way that even a lot of humans can’t seem to do. When talking about how miserable he was he said he looked to the “bleak skies” because "they are kinder to me then your fellow beings. He even seems to remind me a lot of Victor, as they are both intelligent feel things deeply and have a strong connection to the healing power of nature.
William Stastny(Feb 07 2019 2:43PM):
An interesting connection between the monster and Victor.
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They both look to nature to heal them, and they both speak in a highly educated, dramatic manner. That should make you rethink why Frankenstein hates the monster, and if he is even justified in his hate.
ANNA SIEGWALD(Feb 07 2019 2:53PM):
I agree but disagree at the same time.
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In the beginning, Victor seems very mad at the monster when he call the monster a “devil”. While the monster in the beginning is very nice to Victor when he kindly accepts what victor has to say about him.
BREANNA POLLACK(Feb 07 2019 9:09PM):
This is very true. For not being on the world that the long the monster is very intelligent.
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I also agree with you that he is very alike Victor. I think that Victor might have made him so he could have a friend that was similar to him. I think that after he hears his story he will feel more compassion for the monster and help his ‘long lost friend.’
CARTER RICE(Feb 07 2019 2:39PM):
I was surprised that the monster was so eloquent and well-spoken.
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The Monster speaks fluently, with a depth that implies maturity and perspective for a creature so young. At two years old he is more eloquent and well-spoken than a man who is twenty-something! On page 68, “Be calm! I intreat you to hear me, before you give vent to your hatred on my devoted head. Have I not suffered enough, that you seek to increase my misery? …But I will not be tempted to set myself in opposition to thee. I am thy creature, and I will be even mild and docile to my natural lord and king.” When Frankenstein attacks him, he does not retaliate, and instead explains himself in a clear and concise manner. His words flow, and he is clearly capable of very complex thought. This is in sharp contrast to the portrayal of the monster in media, like the movie.
William Stastny(Feb 07 2019 2:49PM):
As a twenty-something man, this comment strikes at a chord that lay deepest in my chest. To hear that you believe a monster, a wretch, a daemon plague upon this earth, speaks more eloquently than I is such sad trash :(
CARTER RICE(Feb 08 2019 2:15PM):
You darest speak ill of my dear, my sweetheart, my innocent child?
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You darest speak ill of my dear, my sweetheart, my innocent child? You darest to assert that you, you are of more intelligence? To learn how to speak so, in two fleeting years? Not you, nor anyone but he could manage such a feat! You hurl insults and mad jibes, but surely you must jest! My dear Monster is no wretch! He is a poor, lost soul, only looking for someone to love him, to care. He is no daemon plague! The only daemon plague on this Earth worthy of the name is Man itself! I should fill with righteous anger at the very idea that this beautiful creature is anything but lovable and dear!
JACKSON GENTGES(Feb 07 2019 2:40PM):
When the monster and Victor met on the mountain, I was surprised that the monster did not harm him, and rather he shared his stories with Victor and offered his hospitality.
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The monster states, “Hear my tale; it is long and strange, and the temperature of this place is not fitting to your fine sensations; come to the hut upon the mountain” (Shelly). This shows that the monster gave Victor his hospitality even after Victor had ridiculed him. He even made sure Victor was not harmed from the cold because of his “fine sensations” (Shelly).
William Stastny(Feb 07 2019 2:47PM):
Nice focus on the hospitality of the monster.
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Does this change the character you “root” for? How do you reconcile this to the fact that the monster murdered poor, innocent William? Do you think he has changed, that he regrets murdering William, or do you think he is trapping Frankenstein?
JACKSON GENTGES(Feb 07 2019 2:54PM):
I disagree Mr. Stastny
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There is strong evidence that the monster killed William, however do we really know that this is the case. It could have been Justine, we don’t really know since the story is being told from Victor’s point of view, rather than it being told from the third person.
ANNA SIEGWALD(Feb 07 2019 2:41PM):
The thing that surprised me is how the monster threatened to kill Victor and all of his friends and wasn't shy about it.
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On page 68, Victor and the monster say their first words to each other. Victor brings up the fact that the monster has already killed two people. The monster gets upset when Victor threatens to kill the monster. The monster responded, “…but if you refuse, I will glut the maw of death, until it be satiated with the blood of your remaining friends”. This is surprising because the monster practicality admitted to murdering Victors friends and openly said that he would kill Victor if he says he would kill the monster.
JADE CIEZAK(Feb 07 2019 2:41PM):
the monster wanted to be loved.<3
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Victor Frankenstein was terrified of the monster that he had created. In the text what surprised me was when the monster states,"Make me happy , and I shall again be virtuous’. The author portrayed the monster to be hideous and evil, when all it wanted was to have a friend. He confided in Frankenstein because he was its creator and his duty was to look after his monster.
JACKSON GENTGES(Feb 07 2019 2:47PM):
I agree Jade.
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The monster seemed distraught after the fact that Victor had despised him, and he just wanted to be loved. The monster was falsely portrayed as a savage, however, I do not believe that this is the case.
DONALD FACCONE(Feb 07 2019 2:42PM):
The monster is trying to reason with Victor and wants to stay alive
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After the monster and Victor exchange there first remarks, Victor lunges for the monster, and the Monster just avoids him,“He easily eluded me, and said,-Be calm! I intreat you to hear me before you give vent to your hatred on my devoted head.”(Page 68) This surprised me because Victor already thinks the monster has killed, so he is trying to kill the monster. The monster could definitely beat Victor in a fight, yet he tries to avoid him and cool him off,yet he wishes to stay alive. The monster could just end victor and not have to worry about him as a threat to his life.
William Stastny(Feb 07 2019 2:45PM):
Good focus on how the monster reacts to threats of violence.
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What does this make you think of the monster? Who seems more reasonable in this seem? Is there any irony? Which character do you feel more of a connection with?
JACKSON GENTGES(Feb 07 2019 2:49PM):
Wow Donald, very interesting.
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I agree on the fact that the monster does not retaliate to Victor’s acts of violence, because he knows that he is much stronger than him and he could potentially kill Victor.
BREANNA POLLACK(Feb 07 2019 2:48PM):
When Victor meet the monster he seemed and explained that he was very miserable.
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“….must I be hated, who am miserable beyond all living things…” (Shelly 68).
After he explains that he is in misery he goes on and says, “I was benevolent and good: misery made me a fiend” (Shelley 69). This made me wonder how could he have been good but then after do terrible things like killing William. What misery is he experiencing to make him be such a awful person?
CAROLINE BAKER(Feb 07 2019 2:51PM):
It surprised me that the monster actually felt emotions.
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When Victor and the monster came face to face, Victor was extremely emotional, as expected. However, what surprised me was that the monster itself also had feelings of turmoil. “All men hate the wretched; how, then, must I be hated, who am miserable beyond all living things! Yet you, my creator, detest and spurn me” (Shelley 68). This feeling of being hated shocked me, as I originally assumed that the monster didn’t care about anything, and was only capable of wrecking havoc.
EMMA PIOTROWSKI(Feb 08 2019 10:45AM):
I agree
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This surprised me as well, When victor says the monster killed Willam the reader sees the monster has heartless, but he tells Victor that he wants to talk which shows he has them
NATHAN LAFEVER(Feb 07 2019 2:56PM):
I was surprised that the monster didn't act out aggressively.
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If the monster actually killed William than I thought that he would be mad that he figures out, however the monster gave an intelligent argument that was effective toward what he was trying to prove.
EMMA PIOTROWSKI(Feb 08 2019 10:41AM):
I was surprised about the monster's demeanor compared to Victor's
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On page 68 Victor says “the extinction of your miserable existence” and the monster says “Be clam”. On this page Victor is aggressive and threatens to kill the monster whereas the monster is calm even while Victor threatens him. This surprised me because the monster is put into a bad light because victor thinks the monster murdered William. The monster, however, is calm and Victor is the aggressive one.
dr. davis eimen(Feb 07 2019 2:39PM):
-Victor Frankenstein is shocked by the monster's ability to communicate with advanced words, as he not only has physical strength, but can speak impressively.
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This makes Frankenstein realize that what he created is now a normal being that functions as a normal human. With this, Frankenstein knows that his creation is more than what he thought it would turn out to be.
CAMILLE KEATY(Feb 07 2019 2:54PM):
Victor doesn't seem surprised that Frankenstein can speak
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Even though the monster he made can talk and is trying to reason with him, Victor is unreasonable and refuses to talk to him and only does out of selfishness and curiosity
William Stastny(Feb 07 2019 2:55PM):
This is true. BUT!
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Why does this matter? Does Frankenstein regret his treatment of the monster now? Does he take pride in the monster now? Is he horrified at how smart it is?
ADAM STETZ(Feb 07 2019 2:58PM):
You told me not too.
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We don’t talk anymore, we don’t talk anymore
We don’t talk anymore, like we used to do
We don’t love anymore
What was all of it for?
Oh, we don’t talk anymore, like we used to do
I just heard you found the one you’ve been looking
You’ve been looking for
I wish I would have known that wasn’t me
‘Cause even after all this time I still wonder
Why I can’t move on
Just the way you did so easily
Don’t wanna know
What kind of dress you’re wearing tonight
If he’s holding onto you so tight
The way I did before
I overdosed
Should’ve known your love was a game
Now I can’t get you out of my brain
Oh, it’s such a shame
That we don’t talk anymore, we don’t talk anymore
We don’t talk anymore, like we used to do
We don’t love anymore
What was all of it for?
Oh, we don’t talk anymore, like we used to do
I just hope you’re lying next to somebody
Who knows how to love you like me
There must be a good reason that you’re gone
Every now and then I think you
Might want me to come show up at your door
But I’m just too afraid that I’ll be wrong
Don’t wanna know
If you’re looking into her eyes
If she’s holding onto you so tight the way I did before
I overdosed
Should’ve known your love was a game
Now I can’t get you out of my brain
Oh, it’s such a shame
That we don’t talk anymore (We don’t, we don’t)
We don’t talk anymore (We don’t, we don’t)
We don’t talk anymore, like we used to do
We don’t love anymore (We don’t, we don’t)
What was all of it for? (We don’t, we don’t)
Oh, we don’t talk anymore, like we used to do
Like we used to do
Don’t wanna know
What kind of dress you’re wearing tonight
If he’s giving it to you just right
The way I did before
I overdosed
Should’ve known your love was a game
Now I can’t get you out of my brain
Oh, it’s such a shame
That we don’t talk anymore (We don’t, we don’t)
We don’t talk anymore (We don’t, we don’t)
We don’t talk anymore, like we used to do
We don’t love anymore (We don’t, we don’t)
What was all of it for? (We don’t, we don’t)
Oh, we don’t talk anymore, like we used to do
We don’t talk anymore, oh, oh
(What kind of dress you’re wearing tonight)
(If he’s holding onto you so tight)
The way I did before
We don’t talk anymore, oh, woah
(Should’ve known your love was a game)
(Now I can’t get you out of my brain)
Ooh, it’s such a shame
That we don’t talk anymore
SARAH MERCIERI(Feb 07 2019 2:39PM):
Victor treats the monster of his creation as a Devil-like creature, giving the reader a bad impression if Victor.
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Victor created the monster to create life out of death and “Bless me as its creator and source; many happy and excellent natures would owe their being to me,” (Shelley pg. 32). Once he has created the monster, he looks on it as ugly, frequently calling it “Abhorred monster” and “Devil” (Shelley pg. 68). This gives the reader a bad impression of Victor because even when the monster attempts to negotiate and talk, Victor refuses to listen saying, “Begone! I will not hear you. There can be no community between you and me” (Shelley pg. 69)
dr. davis eimen(Feb 07 2019 2:49PM):
As the reader, we have already distinguished a disliking of the monster, not Victor.
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The narrator, Victor, describes the monster badly. In our eyes, the monster should be thought of as bad, and we take Victor’s side rather than the monster’s. Sure, Victor isn’t very fond of his creation, but this makes the audience agree with Victor, not dislike him.
HALEY CARLSON(Feb 07 2019 2:59PM):
I agree with your statement, as the way Victor treated the monster also gave me a bad image of Victor.
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I like that you included the quote from page 32 as well as the one on 68, pointing out the fact that Victor was proud of his findings until he felt that he had failed, changing his feelings of his creation as to not deal with his own failure.
BREANNA POLLACK(Feb 07 2019 9:20PM):
I agree, I feel as if Victor never gave the monster a chance to show his true self.
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Right after he met his monster for the first time he fled and never got to meet him. I think that if Victor would have tried to talk with the monster things would have turned out a lot better.
AMANDA DROZT(Feb 08 2019 12:06AM):
I agree with your point.
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As the readers, most of us were focused on the feelings of the monster in this section and we neglected how Victor’s feelings might have changed. Many of use probably agreed with the side of Victor because his brother was killed and the monster was (probably) to blame, but we didn’t look deeper to see why the monster might have killed William.
AMANDA DROZT(Feb 07 2019 2:42PM):
Victor reacts to his monster in an unexpected way, as if he doesn't know how to react to him.
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Once Frankenstein’s monster was alive, it appeared as though Frankenstein was unsure how to react to him. He couldn’t figure out how to “describe [his] emotions at this catastrophe.” (Shelley) Victor clearly spoke about how he didn’t know what to think because “his limbs were in proportion” and “his teeth [had a] pearly whiteness;” however, he has “yellow skin scarcely covering the work of muscles,” and his features were “only a formed a more horrid contrast with his watery eyes” and other terrifying features. (Shelley) Overall, he couldn’t decipher his feelings because on the one hand he created this being and there were some beautiful parts to him, but also, there were parts about him that would make everyone fear him.
AMANDA DROZT(Feb 07 2019 11:59PM):
When Frankenstein and the monster meet again on the mountain Victor reacts with much more hatred toward the monster.
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Once they meet, Victor is quick to hatred and slow to forgiveness. As soon as he sees the monster approaching he calls him the “Devil” and says that he wishes of “the extinction of [his] miserable existence.” (Shelley 68) Even after the monster explains the awfulness that is his life, Victor still shows no sympathy toward him. He exclaims that he “will not here you” and “there can be no community between [them; they] are enemies.” (Shelley 69) Later on he “cursed the day in which [Frankenstein] first saw light.” (Shelley 69) It was clear that he was angry with the monster and refused to change his perspective; however, eventually Frankenstein begins to see the point of the monster and utters that he has left him “no power to consider whether [he] is just to [him], or not.” (Shelley 70) Finally, at the end of their argument, Frankenstein comes around to the monster’s terms and listens to his story. Overall, Victor’s initial reaction toward the monster is pure hatred but eventually comes around enough to at least listen to him.
EMMA PIOTROWSKI(Feb 07 2019 2:45PM):
When victor sees the monster he reacts in a cruel and stubborn manner
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On page 68 Victor says “Devil how dare you approach me, With the extension of your miserable existence” Then the monster says “Be calm!” The moment victor see the monster he gets angry, the monster doesn’t was to fight and just wants to talk. This makes me think victor doesn’t want to talk to the monster because that could mean taking responsibility for his actions. My Impression of Victor is different because I feel he is no longer being a reasonable person and I feel less sorry for him than I used to.
Victor almost seems selfish because he only cares about how he is feeling about the monster and the murder so he just blames the monster with no evidence.
Victor definitely acted out of proportion with little to no evidence that the monster actually did anything wrong. However, you can argue that Victor’s reaction is understandable, given the fact he lost his little brother, and has no one to blame but the monster.
BREANNA POLLACK(Feb 07 2019 9:25PM):
I agree, I don't think that the monster ever wanted to do any harm to anyone but it just happened because he was in misery.
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The monster says, “I was benevolent and good; misery made me a fiend” (Shelley 69).
Victor didn’t want to talk to the monster and find that he is the reason the monster has acted this way. It is selfish, but I think he doesn’t want to accept the fact that he is partially responsible for his brother’s death.
KYLEE MCMULLIN(Feb 07 2019 2:45PM):
It surprised me, even in the beginning of the monsters life, just how quick he is to blame the monster for everything,
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It surprised me, even in the beginning of the monsters life, just how quick he is to blame the monster for everything, even before there was any proof that he did something wrong. When talking to the monster he says very harsh words against him, even going as far to say the “tortures of hell” are "to mild a vengeance for thy crimes, and takes a long time to listen, and it seems very out of character for Victor, who usually seems to reason things out before jumping to conclusions. It makes Victor seem much less innocent in my eyes
HALEY CARLSON(Feb 07 2019 2:54PM):
Victor shows cruelty and hostility to the monster, which I think makes him selfish.
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When Victor and the monster meet again on Pg. 68, Victor immediately begins pushing the monster away by yelling “Devil…do you dare approach me? and do not you fear the fierce vengeance of my arm wreaked on your miserable head?” Victor brought the monster to life and left him in an unfamiliar world to fend for itself, and immediately begins to show only anger and threats to it upon meeting it again. Victor knows that he, by creating the monster and leaving it on its own, is ultimately responsible for Williams death. Instead of facing this, he blames the monster entirely and pushes it away in order to run from his own guilt. Victor is selfish, and willing to put all the blame on his own creation, making it miserable and angry, so that he can live with himself.
I think you made great points about how Victor pushed the monster away instead of admitting that he is partially responsible for William’s death. He selfishly puts the blame on the monster, which he created so he doesn’t have to live with the guilt.
CARTER RICE(Feb 07 2019 2:56PM):
Viktor's reaction to the Monster, while understandable, was purposeless, unhelpful, and willfully ignorant.
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As Frankenstein had no actual proof that the Monster had killed William, and as the Monster was much more powerful than him, his rage and his threats, “Begone, vile insect! or rather, stay, that I might trample you to dust!”(pg 68), while understandable, were probably not the best of ways to open a dialogue. And the fact that this unbridled aggression and open hatred persisted after the Monster asks Frankenstein to listen to reason, indeed, pleads with him to be kind and merciful, to at least give him a chance might shows that Frankenstein is not thinking objectively. He is assuming the monster is evil, and refusing to hear or think anything to the contrary. Yet, the fact that he could eventually be persuaded also shows that he is still himself in there somewhere, the one who loves nature, the romantic.
JOHN MYERS(Feb 07 2019 6:57PM):
I think that based off of Victor's meeting with the monster, you can infer that Victor is one to act before he thinks.
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This is because immediately after coming across the monster in the woods, he expressed how he wanted the monster dead and that because of the things he did, he should be killed. Now, this would make sense, however, Victor still has no solid evidence that the monster was the one that killed his brother. Along with this, Victor also never considered the negative outcomes that could result in attempting to kill the monster.
I agree with Jahseh, but I think Frankenstein might deserve a little leeway here. He had lost his brother which is obviously an emotionally shocking event, and another close one is falsely accused of the murder and convicted, so it’s probably quite hard to think straight after such events have occurred with no answers.
Victor created the monster and then acts like he is this awful creature from another world but in reality he is the one who made him and he is associated with him but he acts like he isn’t. He calls him “daemon” and says “Devil, do you dare approach me?” Like he is so much better than he is but it is his fault he is even around.
dr. davis eimen(Feb 07 2019 2:53PM):
I agree with this statement.
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Victor believed that once he created this monster, he would find a friend in him. He never thought about the flaws that could be present in the rogue creation.
DONALD FACCONE(Feb 07 2019 11:40PM):
Victor is furious with monster
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When Victor and the Monster meet, Victor is convinced that the Monster murdered William, so he can barely contain himself when the meet,“My rage was without bounds; I sprang on him, impelled with all the feelings which can arm one being against the being of another”.(Page 68). Even with the Monster trying to keep things calm, Victor cannot help himself but to attack the monster.
ELLA BEU(Feb 07 2019 2:38PM):
Victor seems more selfish because he acted rudely to the monster.
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“’Devil, I exclaimed, ’do you dare approach me? and do not fear the fierce vengeance of my arm wreaked on your miserable head?” (68). This quote shows that when Victor sees the monster he jumps straight to being rude to him because he is assuming that the monster murdered William. But, Victor doesn’t know that it was for sure the monster and that just shows that he is selfish because he only thinks about how William’s murder is having a toll on him and not how it could affect the monster.
dr. davis eimen(Feb 07 2019 2:44PM):
I agree with this, but I think that Frankenstein was also livid at the monster, as the monster was not convicted of the murder and an innocent person was executed for it.
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JADE CIEZAK(Feb 07 2019 2:54PM):
Victor is an angry coward
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Victor took time to go experience nature and try and heal himself form his grief. However, when he is met with his monster, his demeanor changes and he expresses angry and fright. On page 68, Victor expresses his emotion of, “Rage and horror”. Victor felt that this creature was so evil that the monster claimed Victor, “Propose to kill me”. Victor has no right to claim the monster of killing his brother and ruining his life. it was victors duty to take care of his creation and be proud of it, consider all the time and effort he put into his studies. Victor was acting recklessly and being a cowardly man by running away from his responsibilities.
BREANNA POLLACK(Feb 07 2019 2:59PM):
When Victor meets the monster he is very frightened.
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“I trembled with rage and horror, resolving to wait his approach…” (Shelly 68). But after he hears the monster, he shows compassion to him and feels bad, he decided that he would listen to what the monster had to say. “My heart was full, and I did not answer him; but as I proceeded,I weighed the various arguments that he had used, and determined at least to listen to his tale. I was partly urged by curiosity, and compassion confirmed my resolution” (Shelly 70).
HALEY CARLSON(Feb 07 2019 2:33PM):
I believe that the monster did kill William.
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Although the monster seems peaceful at some points in this chapter, he also has periods of anger and hostility. On page 68, the monster says “If you comply with my conditions, I will leave them and you at peace; but if you refuse, I will glut the maw of death, until it be satiated with the blood of your remaining friends.” Although offering peace at first, he continues to threaten Victor and promises to hurt his friends if things don’t go the way he wants. A phrase that really stood out to me in his threat was “with the blood of your remaining friends.”, notice that he says “remaining” implying that he was involved with the death of William and that he intends to finish the job by killing the rest of Victors loved ones.
William Stastny(Feb 07 2019 2:39PM):
Excellent job reading between the lines, focusing on the word "remaining!"
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With this information in mind (that he killed William and that he can be peaceful and reasonable), what do you think of the monster? Is he a terrible, murderous wretch? Or is he just a kind creature who was put into a difficult situation and reacted poorly to it?
HALEY CARLSON(Feb 07 2019 11:03PM):
I don’t believe that the monster was evil by any means, and I think that Victor had a lot to do with the monster killing William
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Although it’s hard to forgive anybody for committing the crime that the monster did, I don’t think that his actions were entirely his fault. When he meets Victor again, the monster shows somewhat unstable behavior, switching back and forth from being peaceful and reasonable to threatening the life of Victors loved ones. This behavior is a good indication of why he could have committed the crime, a confused and unstable creature in a world entirely new to him. The cause for his unstable and emotional mindset is undoubtedly due to the way he was treated by Victor. Going as far back even to the very first moment that Victor brought life to his creation, the only things he ever felt for it were disgust and anger. It makes sense that the monster, only ever exposed to these negative emotions and pushed away by his own creator, would want to hurt Victor the same way he hurt him. So, although his crime is unforgivable, I don’t believe that the monster is evil. I think he was just put into a situation that he didn’t have the experience or ability to handle properly
JACKSON GENTGES(Feb 07 2019 2:44PM):
Given the way the monster acts, I do not believe that he killed William.
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On page 70, the text reads, “‘Thus I relive thee, my creator,’ he said, and placed his hated hands before my eyes, which I flung from me with violence; ‘thus I take from thee a sight which you abhor. Still thou cant listen to me and grant me thy compassion’” (Shelly). This shows that the monster is very articulate and seems even romantic. The monster cares about Victor “granting him his compassion” (Shelly). The monster was portrayed as a savage in the beginning of the book, however, this seems false.
I agree with your reasoning, and the monster seems to want to dedicate himself to Victor. However, there is the possibility that the Monster could just be sucking up to Victor because he feels bad for the murder, and doesn’t want to kill anymore.
ANNA SIEGWALD(Feb 07 2019 2:49PM):
Yes I think the monster killed William.
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I think the monster is acting all nice to Victor to make it seem like he is a kind person who wouldn’t kill someone. This way Victor can think about how he couldn’t imagine the monster doing anything harsh to someone else. On page 68, the monsters attitude changes when he says “… until it be satiated with the blood of your remaining friends”. This now makes it seem like he is a cruel person who would kill someone like William.
JADE CIEZAK(Feb 07 2019 3:00PM):
I understand your views, but I believe that the monster is telling the truth. the monster did not track him down if he wanted revenge. the monster wanted a friend and someone to look out for him.
SARAH MERCIERI(Feb 07 2019 2:50PM):
I believe the monster did kill William, but he doesn't seem to think much of it.
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The monster essentially admits to killing William while talking to Victor saying that the “Guilty are allowed” to speak and defend themselves (Shelley pg. 69). The monster makes it clear that taking life is insignificant to him and that he will “Glut the maw of death, until it be satiated with the blood” of Victor’s friends and family if Victor does not hear him out (Shelley pg. 68). The monster feels it is Victor’s fault he is hated, and that being hated by the people gives him the right to hurt and kill them.
AMANDA DROZT(Feb 07 2019 11:36PM):
I believe that Frankenstein's monster did kill William.
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Even if throughout the book the monster can show peace and kindness, he can show anger and resentment. Throughout this portion of the book, the monster seems to be explaining why he ran away and how miserable his life is, which all seems relativity calm. But, in the chapter he also states, “if you comply” then “I will them and you at peace;” however, “but if you refuse, I will glut the maw of death, until it be satiated with the blood of your remaining friends.” (Shelley 68) By using the word ‘remaining’ in this statement, the monster implies that he has already taken the life of one of Frankenstein’s friend. Also the monster has a motive to has killed one of his friends. Victor acted so poorly to the monster at the beginning, so it only makes sense that the monster is now acting hostile back at him. Since Victor practically made the monster’s life miserable, the monster is returning the favor and making Victor’s life awful by planning to kill all of his friends.
ELLA BEU(Feb 07 2019 2:43PM):
I do think that the monster killed William because he is trying to blame Victor and cover up the fact that he did murder William.
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“Listen to me, Frankenstein. You accuse me of murder, and yet you would, with a satisfied conscience, destroy your own creature” (69). This quote shows that the monster could have definitely murdered William because he is trying to cover up the fact that he did by blaming Victor. He could be trying to trick Victor into thinking that it wasn’t him.
NATHAN LAFEVER(Feb 07 2019 2:50PM):
No, I don't think he killed William.
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I don’t think that the monster killed William because when Victor accused the Monster of murder,the monster said,“All men hate the wretched; how, then, must I be hated, who am miserable beyond all living things”(68). After the monster is accused he makes claims of how he is being picked on by Victor because he is a monster and how he is miserable . He makes it appear that he didn’t do it because he is saying that Victor only thinks it’s him because the fact that he is a different.
BREANNA POLLACK(Feb 07 2019 8:57PM):
The monster doesn't directly say that he killed William but he hints it.
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He says, “If you will comply with my conditions, I will leave them and you at peace; but if you refuse, I will glut the maw of death, until it be satiated with the blood of your remaining friends”(Shelly 68). When he says your “remaining friends” he hints that he has already killed one and will kill more if Victor does not listen to him. I think that the monster killed William because he was desperate to get Victor’s attention and to scare him into listening to him.
NATHAN LAFEVER(Feb 07 2019 2:40PM):
Yes, I believe that Victor is to blame for the monsters current emotional state.
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On page 68 Victor is speaking aggressively to the monster as he states, “Devil,I exclaimed, do you dare approach me? and do not you fear the fierce vengeance of my arm wreaked on your miserable head”. He called the monster a devil and demonized him. He also threatened to fight him which shows that he is to blame because he caused the monster pain.Especially, because the monster just wanted to be friends with Victor. Victor also accused the monster of murder which could cause the monster become upset/emotional.
JADE CIEZAK(Feb 07 2019 2:56PM):
I believe that victor was being a coward and wanted to cover up the fact that he was ashamed and scared by wanting to kill his creation. So, I agree with your statement. GOOD JOB.
HALEY CARLSON(Feb 07 2019 2:45PM):
Yes, I think that Victor is at least partially to blame for the monsters emotional state
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On page 68 the monster says “All men hate the wretched; how, then, must I be hated, who am miserable beyond all living things! Yet you, my creator , detest and spurn me, they creature, to whom thou art bound by ties only dissoluble by the annihilation of one of us.” Victor played with parts of science and nature that weren’t meant to be played with, created a creature that was never meant to be alive, and brought life to it anyway to satisfy his own curiosity. After bringing the monster, unfamiliar with the world he was brought into, to life, Victor ran from it and pushed it away instead of helping it to adapt. I believe that this is what ultimately led to the monsters miserable emotional state, and that it may have even lead to the monster killing William.
I think that creating the monster and then immediately casting it out was what initially caused the monster’s current emotional state. I don’t think that it is entirely Victor’s fault, but he started the chain of events leading up to William’s death, which makes him responsible in more ways than one.
JOHN MYERS(Feb 07 2019 2:50PM):
Yes, I believe that Frankenstein is completely responsible for the monster's state of mind.
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This is because of the fact that not only did Frankenstein make the monster so terribly ugly and hated, but now Frankenstein would like nothing more than to see the monster die. In the text it stated, “Everywhere I see bliss, from which I alone am irrevocably excluded” (Shelley). It then later went on to say that during Frankenstein and the monster’s conversation, the monster brought up the point that “You purpose to kill me” (Shelley). This inferring that the only thing that Victor intends to do is make sure he sees the “extinction” of the monster’s miserable existence.
NATHAN LAFEVER(Feb 07 2019 2:59PM):
I kinda see what you are saying on how the monster understands his place in the world, however how could this bring him sadness.
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Could you please elaborate on this thought and provide textual evidence to prove your point so it is easier to understand.
EMMA PIOTROWSKI(Feb 07 2019 2:58PM):
I believe that victor is responsible for the monster's emotional state.
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From almost the moment he was created victor hated the monster. On page 35 it says “Breathless horror and disgust filled my heart.” Immediately after being “born” the monster is told he is ugly and his creator runs away. After that Victor does nothing but bash the monster and automatically assume the worst. All the monster knows is that the person who made him hates him and thinks he’s ugly. With no positive support, of course the monster feels the way he does, He has had nothing good or happy in his life.
HALEY CARLSON(Feb 07 2019 10:51PM):
I agree with you, and also think that Victor is responsible for the emotional state of the monster
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I especially like how you mention page 35, when Victor first brings life to the monster, and that he hated the monster as soon as it was created. I believe this is extremely significant, as it tells us that the first emotion the monster was shown was anger and disgust. As a new creature in an unfamiliar world, I’m sure it drastically affected the mindset of the monster when his own creator felt nothing but negative emotions for him.
AMANDA DROZT(Feb 07 2019 2:58PM):
Victor is partially responsible for the monster's emotional state.
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While his state of emotion might not all be Victor’s fault, he does contribute to a big portion of it. Once the monster was created, he did nothing to show kindness to the monster, instead he treated him with rudeness and disrespect. Victor even says that his dream was to create this monster, that he even risked his health and sanity to finish the project. But then, he states that now that he was done, “the beauty of the dream vanished, and breathless horror and disgust filled [his] heart.” (Shelley 35) At the first moments of his monster’s being and from then on behaved toward the monster rudely. He called him “the miserable monster [he] created,” and “the demoniacal corpse to which [he] had so miserably given life.” (Shelley 35/36) Because of the only emotions the monster being exposed to was hatred, it only makes sense that he cannot show or spread kindness, for he has never been taught how and Frankenstein is at fault for that.
DONALD FACCONE(Feb 07 2019 3:21PM):
I believe Victor is to blame for the monsters current emotional state.
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After the Monster and Victor first encounter and Victor attempts to lunge at the Monster, he says,“Have I not suffered enough, that you seek to increase my misery? Life, although it might only be an accumulation of anguish, is dear to me, and I will defend it.”(Page 68). This dialogue shows how much agony the monster has gone through, and Victor attempting to kill him is making him more emotional and defensive.
CAROLINE BAKER(Feb 07 2019 7:01PM):
Yes, I believe Victor is to blame.
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I believe that because Victor lashed out first, the monster got angry, or at least more angry to begin with. On page 68 Victor is quick to anger. “‘Devil,’ I exclaimed, ‘do you dare approach me? and do not you fear the fierce vengeance of my arm wreaked on your miserable head? Begone, vile insect! or rather, stay, that I trample you to dust!’” (Shelley). The monster responds with just as much hostility. “… ‘but if you refuse, I will glut the maw of death, until it be satiated with the blood of your remaining friends.’” I believe that because Victor lashed out first, the monster grew angry at the pure disgust directed at him from his own creator.
SARAH MERCIERI(Feb 08 2019 7:14AM):
I believe that Victor is responsible for the monster's emotional state and actions.
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Immediately after creating the monster that he worked for so long on, he is immediately disgusted by its “shriveled complexion and straight black lips,” (Shelley pg. 35). He rushes out of his house, leaving the monster alone and without any guidance. When Victor and the monster meet later, the monster makes it clear that he too, blames Victor for everything.
ANNA SIEGWALD(Feb 08 2019 9:23AM):
Yes, I do believe that Victor is to blame for the monsters current emotional state.
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Right now the monster is scared, lonely and confused. People are running away from him which makes him feel insecure and lonely. It is Victors fault that the monster feels this way because he is the one who created him and is now scared of him. If you were brought to a world and people weren’t treating you like they others, you you be very upset and wouldn’t know what to do. When the monster came to life, Victor got scared and ran away causing the monster to do the same. This made the monster scared of himself because he didn’t know what was going on.
William Stastny(Feb 07 2019 2:30PM):
I like the idea of conquering nature.
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It seems to fit with Victor’s pursuit of glory and wanting to be God, in a way. Was there anywhere in particular where you noticed his inspiration turning into something more sinister like conquering?
JOHN MYERS(Feb 07 2019 2:58PM):
I agree with your point that Victor is responsible for the state of the monster's mind, but do you think that that is the only reason why the monster's is the way he is.
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Like I said before , I think that him being created the way that he is has something to do with him being in such a terrible state of mind, but do you think that the monster would be in a better state of mind if his creator wasn’t trying to kill him?
William Stastny(Feb 07 2019 2:32PM):
Spot on, young chap!
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The interesting thing to think about is this: will nature be able to heal all of Victor’s pain? Will it be able to take away the guilt he feels for William and Justine, or is he just running away from his problem?
It’d be interesting to connect this to “Rime of the Ancient Mariner.” How does the Mariner absolve his sins and how does Victor?
JOHN MYERS(Feb 07 2019 7:10PM):
I agree with your point, but I also don't.
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In the text it only mentioned that it gave him the greatest consolation of his griefs, but it never stated that it gave him full consolation. I think that on the inside, Victor still has to deal with all of the pain, suffering, and grief from losing his brother and his friend. And also it should be “their” :)
yes, I was also surprised that he could speak considering he is a monster and how he knew that Victor didn’t like him. He escaped the apartment shortly after he was created so I am unsure of how he knew this.
CAMILLE KEATY(Feb 07 2019 2:47PM):
The monster speaks oddly well for what a monster.
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I was surprised that he could speak, but I want to know how he learned to speak and how he is so well educated. Also, how did Victor make him? Was he a dead person that he brought back to life? That would explain why he knows how to talk.
KYLEE MCMULLIN(Feb 07 2019 2:54PM):
Why does the monster know that Victor hates him?
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It’s definitely very interesting that the monster knows that Victor hates him. Maybe after Victor ran away and never came back he realized that someone created him and figured it out from there?
MADISON DENNIS(Feb 07 2019 2:37PM):
choice of words
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The monsters choice of words like “Life, although it may only be an accumulation of anguish, is dear to me, and I will defend it.” when speaking to victor make me feel like he is a romantic just like Victor. You would expect a monster to be not intelligent.
William Stastny(Feb 07 2019 2:41PM):
This is an interesting idea.
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You mention how the monster seems romantic, which I agree with. How were romantics viewed at this time, the time of the industrial revolution? This might be a good way to continue reading the novel—the monster representing romantics and Victor representing some other idea…
CAMILLE KEATY(Feb 07 2019 2:40PM):
Victor refuses to hear the monster talk, which makes him look bad because the monster is threatening his family and he still won't listen.
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“Begone! I will not hear you. There can be no community between you and me; we are enemies.” (Shelley pg 69) Victor made the monster and then refused to ever look at him again, which makes him seem like he has bad character.
I feel like the monster did kill his brother and Justine so I am also confused on why he didn’t want to hear him out when he could just go and kill other people he loves because Victor is so mean to him.
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Throughout the novel so far, nature is used as a rehabilitation point. For example on page 66, “It filled me with a sublime ecstasy, that gave wings to the soul, and allowed it to soar from the obscure world to light and joy. The sight of the awful and majestic in nature had indeed always the effect of solemnizing my mind and causing me to forget the passing cares of life” (Shelly). This illuminates the fact that Mary Shelly believes that nature “solemnizes the mind” (Shelly). In all of the chaos that is occurring in Dr. Frankenstein’s life, he finds peace in nature.
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Frankenstein called the monster horrible names and made it feel unloved causing it to become jealous and be the possible cause of his brothers death
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Where is there any evidence of Frankenstein calling the monster horrible names and making it feel unloved?
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I agree with the fact that Frankenstein has something to do with the monster’s state of mind, however, I do believe the monster’s action also have to do with his state of mind, possibly because of the guilt that he has to deal with after killing his creator’s brother.
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I understand that the monster can be friendly and experience love but I believe if William had provoked it, it would have killed him
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If this is true, is the monster fully to blame for William’s death? How would that impact your view of the monster going forward?
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my views on the monster are fairly negative
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On page 66, Frenkinstein claims, “They elevated me from all littleness of feeling..” Victor found peace and comfort in nature while on his journey. The effect that environment can heal a person in any form of illness it may have. It may not cure them, but it distracts the individual of the pain and sadness that they feel.
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Is distracting himself a good idea? Or do you think Frankenstein is running away from his problems instead of facing them head on?
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I feel like he is trying to run away from his problems and forget about what he did but instead runs directly into his problem which is just karma.
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He might have been hoping that the monster would just disappear and his problems would be solved
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I think that nature does make Victor find comfort because it is not only healing him but it is giving him a chance to forget about what has happened for a while.
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“The sight of the awful and majestic in mature had indeed always the effect of solemnising my mind and causing me to forget the passing cares of life” (66). This quote shows that because Victor was living with the guilt of being the cause of William’s murder he went to nature to forget about it all for a while.
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What might happen to Victor’s family when he runs away into the woods? How have they reacted in the past when he has “disappeared”? What does this say about Victor and his relationship with his family?
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Frankenstein has always loved the changing of the seasons and nature in general. Even after finding about the death of his own brother, nature still managed to cheer him up. “It was a divine spring; and the seasons contributed greatly to my convalescence” (Shelley 39). Here, he clearly states that the spring time cheered him up from that tragic event.
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Victor might be a bit of a weirdo. With that in mind, where do other people look for comfort during challenging times? Why doesn’t Victor do the same? What message might this be sending about a pretty important idea?
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Throughout the text it seems that Frankenstein has always loved nature and he has always seen it to be peaceful and a place to just relax. I think your comment and evidence summarized his true feelings about nature around him nicely.
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“The sight of the awful and majestic in nature had indeed always the effect of solemnising my mind and causing me to forget the passing cares of life
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When he is in nature he seems to feel more inspired by all that is around him. It also caused him to forget the passing cares of his life, so he felt at peace in nature and when he was in nature he was no longer lonely.
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This is true because when victor tried to create something that was unnatural that is a living thing, nature responded by giving him a monster. Once the monster became a part of nature, Frankenstein decided to neglect it and keep it away, so nature further punishes him and makes the monster affect is life even after neglecting it, William dies, Justine is executed because she is accused of his murder and so forth.
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I agree with this statement because Frankenstein does try to ignore the the unnatural(the monster) rather than doing something about him, so then nature or the natural way life goes affects Frankenstein negatively by harming his family.
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I think that nature calms Victor and offers him an escape from what has happened in his life. While In nature he says that the scenes gave him the “greatest consolation” that he was “capable of receiving”
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This is true when you look at Chapter whatever and see Victor go to Chamonix for refuge. He remarks how great he feels when he says, “QUOTE” (Shelley Whatever).
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When Frankenstein went to the mountains he found everything to be very calming. “..gathered around me and bade me be at peace.” (Shelley, pg 66)
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Nature is a place of peace so I think Shelley is trying to convey the message that nature can help people get over things and not let it weigh them down so much.
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This is very true because on page 66, (talking about nature) It says .."that gathered around me and bade me be at peace.” This shows that Shelley thinks nature is a place for peace and away from your troubles.
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I was surprised when the monster didn’t act violent or try to do something to Victor when he ran at him because Victor describes him as an awful creature but if he was as awful as we think he is then he could’ve just killed him instead of telling Victor to “Be calm!”
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Victor described the monster as advancing toward him at superhuman speed, making it seem like he was going to hurt him.
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You picture this big, ugly creature and you would imagine that he would be mean. Instead, the monster took the situation in a way that was very shocking.
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It surprised me that the monster was very intelligent and seems to feel things very deeply, in a way that even a lot of humans can’t seem to do. When talking about how miserable he was he said he looked to the “bleak skies” because "they are kinder to me then your fellow beings. He even seems to remind me a lot of Victor, as they are both intelligent feel things deeply and have a strong connection to the healing power of nature.
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They both look to nature to heal them, and they both speak in a highly educated, dramatic manner. That should make you rethink why Frankenstein hates the monster, and if he is even justified in his hate.
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In the beginning, Victor seems very mad at the monster when he call the monster a “devil”. While the monster in the beginning is very nice to Victor when he kindly accepts what victor has to say about him.
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I also agree with you that he is very alike Victor. I think that Victor might have made him so he could have a friend that was similar to him. I think that after he hears his story he will feel more compassion for the monster and help his ‘long lost friend.’
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The Monster speaks fluently, with a depth that implies maturity and perspective for a creature so young. At two years old he is more eloquent and well-spoken than a man who is twenty-something! On page 68, “Be calm! I intreat you to hear me, before you give vent to your hatred on my devoted head. Have I not suffered enough, that you seek to increase my misery? …But I will not be tempted to set myself in opposition to thee. I am thy creature, and I will be even mild and docile to my natural lord and king.” When Frankenstein attacks him, he does not retaliate, and instead explains himself in a clear and concise manner. His words flow, and he is clearly capable of very complex thought. This is in sharp contrast to the portrayal of the monster in media, like the movie.
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You darest speak ill of my dear, my sweetheart, my innocent child? You darest to assert that you, you are of more intelligence? To learn how to speak so, in two fleeting years? Not you, nor anyone but he could manage such a feat! You hurl insults and mad jibes, but surely you must jest! My dear Monster is no wretch! He is a poor, lost soul, only looking for someone to love him, to care. He is no daemon plague! The only daemon plague on this Earth worthy of the name is Man itself! I should fill with righteous anger at the very idea that this beautiful creature is anything but lovable and dear!
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The monster states, “Hear my tale; it is long and strange, and the temperature of this place is not fitting to your fine sensations; come to the hut upon the mountain” (Shelly). This shows that the monster gave Victor his hospitality even after Victor had ridiculed him. He even made sure Victor was not harmed from the cold because of his “fine sensations” (Shelly).
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Does this change the character you “root” for? How do you reconcile this to the fact that the monster murdered poor, innocent William? Do you think he has changed, that he regrets murdering William, or do you think he is trapping Frankenstein?
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There is strong evidence that the monster killed William, however do we really know that this is the case. It could have been Justine, we don’t really know since the story is being told from Victor’s point of view, rather than it being told from the third person.
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On page 68, Victor and the monster say their first words to each other. Victor brings up the fact that the monster has already killed two people. The monster gets upset when Victor threatens to kill the monster. The monster responded, “…but if you refuse, I will glut the maw of death, until it be satiated with the blood of your remaining friends”. This is surprising because the monster practicality admitted to murdering Victors friends and openly said that he would kill Victor if he says he would kill the monster.
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Victor Frankenstein was terrified of the monster that he had created. In the text what surprised me was when the monster states,"Make me happy , and I shall again be virtuous’. The author portrayed the monster to be hideous and evil, when all it wanted was to have a friend. He confided in Frankenstein because he was its creator and his duty was to look after his monster.
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The monster seemed distraught after the fact that Victor had despised him, and he just wanted to be loved. The monster was falsely portrayed as a savage, however, I do not believe that this is the case.
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After the monster and Victor exchange there first remarks, Victor lunges for the monster, and the Monster just avoids him,“He easily eluded me, and said,-Be calm! I intreat you to hear me before you give vent to your hatred on my devoted head.”(Page 68) This surprised me because Victor already thinks the monster has killed, so he is trying to kill the monster. The monster could definitely beat Victor in a fight, yet he tries to avoid him and cool him off,yet he wishes to stay alive. The monster could just end victor and not have to worry about him as a threat to his life.
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What does this make you think of the monster? Who seems more reasonable in this seem? Is there any irony? Which character do you feel more of a connection with?
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I agree on the fact that the monster does not retaliate to Victor’s acts of violence, because he knows that he is much stronger than him and he could potentially kill Victor.
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“….must I be hated, who am miserable beyond all living things…” (Shelly 68).
After he explains that he is in misery he goes on and says, “I was benevolent and good: misery made me a fiend” (Shelley 69). This made me wonder how could he have been good but then after do terrible things like killing William. What misery is he experiencing to make him be such a awful person?
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Do you have any guesses? Based on what we know about the monster’s appearance and his interactions with Victor, what do you think has happened to him?
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When Victor and the monster came face to face, Victor was extremely emotional, as expected. However, what surprised me was that the monster itself also had feelings of turmoil. “All men hate the wretched; how, then, must I be hated, who am miserable beyond all living things! Yet you, my creator, detest and spurn me” (Shelley 68). This feeling of being hated shocked me, as I originally assumed that the monster didn’t care about anything, and was only capable of wrecking havoc.
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Victor was very emotional and wasn’t sure how to respond to the creature that he thinks killed his innocent brother.
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Based on how the monster has always been treated, it was surprising to me that he had true emotions and was just a pit of anger and havoc.
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This surprised me as well, When victor says the monster killed Willam the reader sees the monster has heartless, but he tells Victor that he wants to talk which shows he has them
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If the monster actually killed William than I thought that he would be mad that he figures out, however the monster gave an intelligent argument that was effective toward what he was trying to prove.
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On page 68 Victor says “the extinction of your miserable existence” and the monster says “Be clam”. On this page Victor is aggressive and threatens to kill the monster whereas the monster is calm even while Victor threatens him. This surprised me because the monster is put into a bad light because victor thinks the monster murdered William. The monster, however, is calm and Victor is the aggressive one.
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This makes Frankenstein realize that what he created is now a normal being that functions as a normal human. With this, Frankenstein knows that his creation is more than what he thought it would turn out to be.
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Even though the monster he made can talk and is trying to reason with him, Victor is unreasonable and refuses to talk to him and only does out of selfishness and curiosity
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Why does this matter? Does Frankenstein regret his treatment of the monster now? Does he take pride in the monster now? Is he horrified at how smart it is?
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bruh
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We don’t talk anymore, we don’t talk anymore
We don’t talk anymore, like we used to do
We don’t love anymore
What was all of it for?
Oh, we don’t talk anymore, like we used to do
I just heard you found the one you’ve been looking
You’ve been looking for
I wish I would have known that wasn’t me
‘Cause even after all this time I still wonder
Why I can’t move on
Just the way you did so easily
Don’t wanna know
What kind of dress you’re wearing tonight
If he’s holding onto you so tight
The way I did before
I overdosed
Should’ve known your love was a game
Now I can’t get you out of my brain
Oh, it’s such a shame
That we don’t talk anymore, we don’t talk anymore
We don’t talk anymore, like we used to do
We don’t love anymore
What was all of it for?
Oh, we don’t talk anymore, like we used to do
I just hope you’re lying next to somebody
Who knows how to love you like me
There must be a good reason that you’re gone
Every now and then I think you
Might want me to come show up at your door
But I’m just too afraid that I’ll be wrong
Don’t wanna know
If you’re looking into her eyes
If she’s holding onto you so tight the way I did before
I overdosed
Should’ve known your love was a game
Now I can’t get you out of my brain
Oh, it’s such a shame
That we don’t talk anymore (We don’t, we don’t)
We don’t talk anymore (We don’t, we don’t)
We don’t talk anymore, like we used to do
We don’t love anymore (We don’t, we don’t)
What was all of it for? (We don’t, we don’t)
Oh, we don’t talk anymore, like we used to do
Like we used to do
Don’t wanna know
What kind of dress you’re wearing tonight
If he’s giving it to you just right
The way I did before
I overdosed
Should’ve known your love was a game
Now I can’t get you out of my brain
Oh, it’s such a shame
That we don’t talk anymore (We don’t, we don’t)
We don’t talk anymore (We don’t, we don’t)
We don’t talk anymore, like we used to do
We don’t love anymore (We don’t, we don’t)
What was all of it for? (We don’t, we don’t)
Oh, we don’t talk anymore, like we used to do
We don’t talk anymore, oh, oh
(What kind of dress you’re wearing tonight)
(If he’s holding onto you so tight)
The way I did before
We don’t talk anymore, oh, woah
(Should’ve known your love was a game)
(Now I can’t get you out of my brain)
Ooh, it’s such a shame
That we don’t talk anymore
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I think Victor thought that the monster was articulate, but also barbaric at the same time. Victor did not doubt the power of his monster.
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Victor created the monster to create life out of death and “Bless me as its creator and source; many happy and excellent natures would owe their being to me,” (Shelley pg. 32). Once he has created the monster, he looks on it as ugly, frequently calling it “Abhorred monster” and “Devil” (Shelley pg. 68). This gives the reader a bad impression of Victor because even when the monster attempts to negotiate and talk, Victor refuses to listen saying, “Begone! I will not hear you. There can be no community between you and me” (Shelley pg. 69)
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The narrator, Victor, describes the monster badly. In our eyes, the monster should be thought of as bad, and we take Victor’s side rather than the monster’s. Sure, Victor isn’t very fond of his creation, but this makes the audience agree with Victor, not dislike him.
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I like that you included the quote from page 32 as well as the one on 68, pointing out the fact that Victor was proud of his findings until he felt that he had failed, changing his feelings of his creation as to not deal with his own failure.
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Victor was clearly emotional and in denial and needed someone to blame for the death of his brother.
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Right after he met his monster for the first time he fled and never got to meet him. I think that if Victor would have tried to talk with the monster things would have turned out a lot better.
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As the readers, most of us were focused on the feelings of the monster in this section and we neglected how Victor’s feelings might have changed. Many of use probably agreed with the side of Victor because his brother was killed and the monster was (probably) to blame, but we didn’t look deeper to see why the monster might have killed William.
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Victor acts so mean and heartless towards the monster when the monster never did anything to him.
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Once Frankenstein’s monster was alive, it appeared as though Frankenstein was unsure how to react to him. He couldn’t figure out how to “describe [his] emotions at this catastrophe.” (Shelley) Victor clearly spoke about how he didn’t know what to think because “his limbs were in proportion” and “his teeth [had a] pearly whiteness;” however, he has “yellow skin scarcely covering the work of muscles,” and his features were “only a formed a more horrid contrast with his watery eyes” and other terrifying features. (Shelley) Overall, he couldn’t decipher his feelings because on the one hand he created this being and there were some beautiful parts to him, but also, there were parts about him that would make everyone fear him.
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Victor can’t decipher the way he feels about his own creation. I think the quotes you chose really showed how he had a love-hate kind of reaction.
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What about their meeting on the mountain, though? Is he still confused about how to react? Or has he decided it is good/evil?
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Once they meet, Victor is quick to hatred and slow to forgiveness. As soon as he sees the monster approaching he calls him the “Devil” and says that he wishes of “the extinction of [his] miserable existence.” (Shelley 68) Even after the monster explains the awfulness that is his life, Victor still shows no sympathy toward him. He exclaims that he “will not here you” and “there can be no community between [them; they] are enemies.” (Shelley 69) Later on he “cursed the day in which [Frankenstein] first saw light.” (Shelley 69) It was clear that he was angry with the monster and refused to change his perspective; however, eventually Frankenstein begins to see the point of the monster and utters that he has left him “no power to consider whether [he] is just to [him], or not.” (Shelley 70) Finally, at the end of their argument, Frankenstein comes around to the monster’s terms and listens to his story. Overall, Victor’s initial reaction toward the monster is pure hatred but eventually comes around enough to at least listen to him.
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On page 68 Victor says “Devil how dare you approach me, With the extension of your miserable existence” Then the monster says “Be calm!” The moment victor see the monster he gets angry, the monster doesn’t was to fight and just wants to talk. This makes me think victor doesn’t want to talk to the monster because that could mean taking responsibility for his actions. My Impression of Victor is different because I feel he is no longer being a reasonable person and I feel less sorry for him than I used to.
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Victor almost seems selfish because he only cares about how he is feeling about the monster and the murder so he just blames the monster with no evidence.
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Victor definitely acted out of proportion with little to no evidence that the monster actually did anything wrong. However, you can argue that Victor’s reaction is understandable, given the fact he lost his little brother, and has no one to blame but the monster.
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The monster says, “I was benevolent and good; misery made me a fiend” (Shelley 69).
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Victor didn’t want to talk to the monster and find that he is the reason the monster has acted this way. It is selfish, but I think he doesn’t want to accept the fact that he is partially responsible for his brother’s death.
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It surprised me, even in the beginning of the monsters life, just how quick he is to blame the monster for everything, even before there was any proof that he did something wrong. When talking to the monster he says very harsh words against him, even going as far to say the “tortures of hell” are "to mild a vengeance for thy crimes, and takes a long time to listen, and it seems very out of character for Victor, who usually seems to reason things out before jumping to conclusions. It makes Victor seem much less innocent in my eyes
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When Victor and the monster meet again on Pg. 68, Victor immediately begins pushing the monster away by yelling “Devil…do you dare approach me? and do not you fear the fierce vengeance of my arm wreaked on your miserable head?” Victor brought the monster to life and left him in an unfamiliar world to fend for itself, and immediately begins to show only anger and threats to it upon meeting it again. Victor knows that he, by creating the monster and leaving it on its own, is ultimately responsible for Williams death. Instead of facing this, he blames the monster entirely and pushes it away in order to run from his own guilt. Victor is selfish, and willing to put all the blame on his own creation, making it miserable and angry, so that he can live with himself.
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I think you made great points about how Victor pushed the monster away instead of admitting that he is partially responsible for William’s death. He selfishly puts the blame on the monster, which he created so he doesn’t have to live with the guilt.
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As Frankenstein had no actual proof that the Monster had killed William, and as the Monster was much more powerful than him, his rage and his threats, “Begone, vile insect! or rather, stay, that I might trample you to dust!”(pg 68), while understandable, were probably not the best of ways to open a dialogue. And the fact that this unbridled aggression and open hatred persisted after the Monster asks Frankenstein to listen to reason, indeed, pleads with him to be kind and merciful, to at least give him a chance might shows that Frankenstein is not thinking objectively. He is assuming the monster is evil, and refusing to hear or think anything to the contrary. Yet, the fact that he could eventually be persuaded also shows that he is still himself in there somewhere, the one who loves nature, the romantic.
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This is because immediately after coming across the monster in the woods, he expressed how he wanted the monster dead and that because of the things he did, he should be killed. Now, this would make sense, however, Victor still has no solid evidence that the monster was the one that killed his brother. Along with this, Victor also never considered the negative outcomes that could result in attempting to kill the monster.
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I agree with Jahseh, but I think Frankenstein might deserve a little leeway here. He had lost his brother which is obviously an emotionally shocking event, and another close one is falsely accused of the murder and convicted, so it’s probably quite hard to think straight after such events have occurred with no answers.
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Victor created the monster and then acts like he is this awful creature from another world but in reality he is the one who made him and he is associated with him but he acts like he isn’t. He calls him “daemon” and says “Devil, do you dare approach me?” Like he is so much better than he is but it is his fault he is even around.
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Victor believed that once he created this monster, he would find a friend in him. He never thought about the flaws that could be present in the rogue creation.
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I feel like Victor is required to hear him out because he brought him to life and then wouldn’t associate with him when he was all the monster had.
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When Victor and the Monster meet, Victor is convinced that the Monster murdered William, so he can barely contain himself when the meet,“My rage was without bounds; I sprang on him, impelled with all the feelings which can arm one being against the being of another”.(Page 68). Even with the Monster trying to keep things calm, Victor cannot help himself but to attack the monster.
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“’Devil, I exclaimed, ’do you dare approach me? and do not fear the fierce vengeance of my arm wreaked on your miserable head?” (68). This quote shows that when Victor sees the monster he jumps straight to being rude to him because he is assuming that the monster murdered William. But, Victor doesn’t know that it was for sure the monster and that just shows that he is selfish because he only thinks about how William’s murder is having a toll on him and not how it could affect the monster.
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Victor took time to go experience nature and try and heal himself form his grief. However, when he is met with his monster, his demeanor changes and he expresses angry and fright. On page 68, Victor expresses his emotion of, “Rage and horror”. Victor felt that this creature was so evil that the monster claimed Victor, “Propose to kill me”. Victor has no right to claim the monster of killing his brother and ruining his life. it was victors duty to take care of his creation and be proud of it, consider all the time and effort he put into his studies. Victor was acting recklessly and being a cowardly man by running away from his responsibilities.
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“I trembled with rage and horror, resolving to wait his approach…” (Shelly 68). But after he hears the monster, he shows compassion to him and feels bad, he decided that he would listen to what the monster had to say. “My heart was full, and I did not answer him; but as I proceeded,I weighed the various arguments that he had used, and determined at least to listen to his tale. I was partly urged by curiosity, and compassion confirmed my resolution” (Shelly 70).
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Although the monster seems peaceful at some points in this chapter, he also has periods of anger and hostility. On page 68, the monster says “If you comply with my conditions, I will leave them and you at peace; but if you refuse, I will glut the maw of death, until it be satiated with the blood of your remaining friends.” Although offering peace at first, he continues to threaten Victor and promises to hurt his friends if things don’t go the way he wants. A phrase that really stood out to me in his threat was “with the blood of your remaining friends.”, notice that he says “remaining” implying that he was involved with the death of William and that he intends to finish the job by killing the rest of Victors loved ones.
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With this information in mind (that he killed William and that he can be peaceful and reasonable), what do you think of the monster? Is he a terrible, murderous wretch? Or is he just a kind creature who was put into a difficult situation and reacted poorly to it?
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Although it’s hard to forgive anybody for committing the crime that the monster did, I don’t think that his actions were entirely his fault. When he meets Victor again, the monster shows somewhat unstable behavior, switching back and forth from being peaceful and reasonable to threatening the life of Victors loved ones. This behavior is a good indication of why he could have committed the crime, a confused and unstable creature in a world entirely new to him. The cause for his unstable and emotional mindset is undoubtedly due to the way he was treated by Victor. Going as far back even to the very first moment that Victor brought life to his creation, the only things he ever felt for it were disgust and anger. It makes sense that the monster, only ever exposed to these negative emotions and pushed away by his own creator, would want to hurt Victor the same way he hurt him. So, although his crime is unforgivable, I don’t believe that the monster is evil. I think he was just put into a situation that he didn’t have the experience or ability to handle properly
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On page 70, the text reads, “‘Thus I relive thee, my creator,’ he said, and placed his hated hands before my eyes, which I flung from me with violence; ‘thus I take from thee a sight which you abhor. Still thou cant listen to me and grant me thy compassion’” (Shelly). This shows that the monster is very articulate and seems even romantic. The monster cares about Victor “granting him his compassion” (Shelly). The monster was portrayed as a savage in the beginning of the book, however, this seems false.
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I agree with your reasoning, and the monster seems to want to dedicate himself to Victor. However, there is the possibility that the Monster could just be sucking up to Victor because he feels bad for the murder, and doesn’t want to kill anymore.
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I think the monster is acting all nice to Victor to make it seem like he is a kind person who wouldn’t kill someone. This way Victor can think about how he couldn’t imagine the monster doing anything harsh to someone else. On page 68, the monsters attitude changes when he says “… until it be satiated with the blood of your remaining friends”. This now makes it seem like he is a cruel person who would kill someone like William.
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The monster essentially admits to killing William while talking to Victor saying that the “Guilty are allowed” to speak and defend themselves (Shelley pg. 69). The monster makes it clear that taking life is insignificant to him and that he will “Glut the maw of death, until it be satiated with the blood” of Victor’s friends and family if Victor does not hear him out (Shelley pg. 68). The monster feels it is Victor’s fault he is hated, and that being hated by the people gives him the right to hurt and kill them.
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Although the monster is much more smart, and speaks with big words, he has the intellect to understand his actions
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Even if throughout the book the monster can show peace and kindness, he can show anger and resentment. Throughout this portion of the book, the monster seems to be explaining why he ran away and how miserable his life is, which all seems relativity calm. But, in the chapter he also states, “if you comply” then “I will them and you at peace;” however, “but if you refuse, I will glut the maw of death, until it be satiated with the blood of your remaining friends.” (Shelley 68) By using the word ‘remaining’ in this statement, the monster implies that he has already taken the life of one of Frankenstein’s friend. Also the monster has a motive to has killed one of his friends. Victor acted so poorly to the monster at the beginning, so it only makes sense that the monster is now acting hostile back at him. Since Victor practically made the monster’s life miserable, the monster is returning the favor and making Victor’s life awful by planning to kill all of his friends.
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“Listen to me, Frankenstein. You accuse me of murder, and yet you would, with a satisfied conscience, destroy your own creature” (69). This quote shows that the monster could have definitely murdered William because he is trying to cover up the fact that he did by blaming Victor. He could be trying to trick Victor into thinking that it wasn’t him.
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I don’t think that the monster killed William because when Victor accused the Monster of murder,the monster said,“All men hate the wretched; how, then, must I be hated, who am miserable beyond all living things”(68). After the monster is accused he makes claims of how he is being picked on by Victor because he is a monster and how he is miserable . He makes it appear that he didn’t do it because he is saying that Victor only thinks it’s him because the fact that he is a different.
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He says, “If you will comply with my conditions, I will leave them and you at peace; but if you refuse, I will glut the maw of death, until it be satiated with the blood of your remaining friends”(Shelly 68). When he says your “remaining friends” he hints that he has already killed one and will kill more if Victor does not listen to him. I think that the monster killed William because he was desperate to get Victor’s attention and to scare him into listening to him.
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On page 68 Victor is speaking aggressively to the monster as he states, “Devil,I exclaimed, do you dare approach me? and do not you fear the fierce vengeance of my arm wreaked on your miserable head”. He called the monster a devil and demonized him. He also threatened to fight him which shows that he is to blame because he caused the monster pain.Especially, because the monster just wanted to be friends with Victor. Victor also accused the monster of murder which could cause the monster become upset/emotional.
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On page 68 the monster says “All men hate the wretched; how, then, must I be hated, who am miserable beyond all living things! Yet you, my creator , detest and spurn me, they creature, to whom thou art bound by ties only dissoluble by the annihilation of one of us.” Victor played with parts of science and nature that weren’t meant to be played with, created a creature that was never meant to be alive, and brought life to it anyway to satisfy his own curiosity. After bringing the monster, unfamiliar with the world he was brought into, to life, Victor ran from it and pushed it away instead of helping it to adapt. I believe that this is what ultimately led to the monsters miserable emotional state, and that it may have even lead to the monster killing William.
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I think that creating the monster and then immediately casting it out was what initially caused the monster’s current emotional state. I don’t think that it is entirely Victor’s fault, but he started the chain of events leading up to William’s death, which makes him responsible in more ways than one.
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Victor is the first person the monster saw and Victor was nothing but mean. How could that not affect someones emotional state?
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This is because of the fact that not only did Frankenstein make the monster so terribly ugly and hated, but now Frankenstein would like nothing more than to see the monster die. In the text it stated, “Everywhere I see bliss, from which I alone am irrevocably excluded” (Shelley). It then later went on to say that during Frankenstein and the monster’s conversation, the monster brought up the point that “You purpose to kill me” (Shelley). This inferring that the only thing that Victor intends to do is make sure he sees the “extinction” of the monster’s miserable existence.
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Victor created the monster and now that the monster understands his place in the World, this must bring him sadness.
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Could you please elaborate on this thought and provide textual evidence to prove your point so it is easier to understand.
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From almost the moment he was created victor hated the monster. On page 35 it says “Breathless horror and disgust filled my heart.” Immediately after being “born” the monster is told he is ugly and his creator runs away. After that Victor does nothing but bash the monster and automatically assume the worst. All the monster knows is that the person who made him hates him and thinks he’s ugly. With no positive support, of course the monster feels the way he does, He has had nothing good or happy in his life.
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I especially like how you mention page 35, when Victor first brings life to the monster, and that he hated the monster as soon as it was created. I believe this is extremely significant, as it tells us that the first emotion the monster was shown was anger and disgust. As a new creature in an unfamiliar world, I’m sure it drastically affected the mindset of the monster when his own creator felt nothing but negative emotions for him.
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While his state of emotion might not all be Victor’s fault, he does contribute to a big portion of it. Once the monster was created, he did nothing to show kindness to the monster, instead he treated him with rudeness and disrespect. Victor even says that his dream was to create this monster, that he even risked his health and sanity to finish the project. But then, he states that now that he was done, “the beauty of the dream vanished, and breathless horror and disgust filled [his] heart.” (Shelley 35) At the first moments of his monster’s being and from then on behaved toward the monster rudely. He called him “the miserable monster [he] created,” and “the demoniacal corpse to which [he] had so miserably given life.” (Shelley 35/36) Because of the only emotions the monster being exposed to was hatred, it only makes sense that he cannot show or spread kindness, for he has never been taught how and Frankenstein is at fault for that.
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After the Monster and Victor first encounter and Victor attempts to lunge at the Monster, he says,“Have I not suffered enough, that you seek to increase my misery? Life, although it might only be an accumulation of anguish, is dear to me, and I will defend it.”(Page 68). This dialogue shows how much agony the monster has gone through, and Victor attempting to kill him is making him more emotional and defensive.
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I believe that because Victor lashed out first, the monster got angry, or at least more angry to begin with. On page 68 Victor is quick to anger. “‘Devil,’ I exclaimed, ‘do you dare approach me? and do not you fear the fierce vengeance of my arm wreaked on your miserable head? Begone, vile insect! or rather, stay, that I trample you to dust!’” (Shelley). The monster responds with just as much hostility. “… ‘but if you refuse, I will glut the maw of death, until it be satiated with the blood of your remaining friends.’” I believe that because Victor lashed out first, the monster grew angry at the pure disgust directed at him from his own creator.
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Immediately after creating the monster that he worked for so long on, he is immediately disgusted by its “shriveled complexion and straight black lips,” (Shelley pg. 35). He rushes out of his house, leaving the monster alone and without any guidance. When Victor and the monster meet later, the monster makes it clear that he too, blames Victor for everything.
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Right now the monster is scared, lonely and confused. People are running away from him which makes him feel insecure and lonely. It is Victors fault that the monster feels this way because he is the one who created him and is now scared of him. If you were brought to a world and people weren’t treating you like they others, you you be very upset and wouldn’t know what to do. When the monster came to life, Victor got scared and ran away causing the monster to do the same. This made the monster scared of himself because he didn’t know what was going on.
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General Document Comments 0
when looking at nature victor frankenstein sees beauty, but he also desires to learn of and conquer the natural world around him.
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It seems to fit with Victor’s pursuit of glory and wanting to be God, in a way. Was there anywhere in particular where you noticed his inspiration turning into something more sinister like conquering?
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death is part of life and part of nature, which is why victor wanted to conquer death and turn it into life.
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if victor hadn’t created the monster, then the monster wouldn’t be in his current emotional state.
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This might be true, but it is missing the point of the question. Is the way Victor TREATS the monster the cause of the monster’s emotional state.
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Like I said before , I think that him being created the way that he is has something to do with him being in such a terrible state of mind, but do you think that the monster would be in a better state of mind if his creator wasn’t trying to kill him?
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“These sublime and magnificent scenes afforded me with the greatest consolation that I was capable of recieving” (Shelley).
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The interesting thing to think about is this: will nature be able to heal all of Victor’s pain? Will it be able to take away the guilt he feels for William and Justine, or is he just running away from his problem?
It’d be interesting to connect this to “Rime of the Ancient Mariner.” How does the Mariner absolve his sins and how does Victor?
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I agree because in the novel it relieves Victor and makes him forget all the passing cares of life.
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In the text it only mentioned that it gave him the greatest consolation of his griefs, but it never stated that it gave him full consolation. I think that on the inside, Victor still has to deal with all of the pain, suffering, and grief from losing his brother and his friend. And also it should be “their” :)
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“‘yet you, my creator, detest and spurn me’”. (Shelley pg 68)
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yes, I was also surprised that he could speak considering he is a monster and how he knew that Victor didn’t like him. He escaped the apartment shortly after he was created so I am unsure of how he knew this.
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How educated does the monster seem? Where could he have gotten that education? Does he speak how you’d imagine a murderer to speak?
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I was surprised that he could speak, but I want to know how he learned to speak and how he is so well educated. Also, how did Victor make him? Was he a dead person that he brought back to life? That would explain why he knows how to talk.
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It’s definitely very interesting that the monster knows that Victor hates him. Maybe after Victor ran away and never came back he realized that someone created him and figured it out from there?
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The monsters choice of words like “Life, although it may only be an accumulation of anguish, is dear to me, and I will defend it.” when speaking to victor make me feel like he is a romantic just like Victor. You would expect a monster to be not intelligent.
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You mention how the monster seems romantic, which I agree with. How were romantics viewed at this time, the time of the industrial revolution? This might be a good way to continue reading the novel—the monster representing romantics and Victor representing some other idea…
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“Begone! I will not hear you. There can be no community between you and me; we are enemies.” (Shelley pg 69) Victor made the monster and then refused to ever look at him again, which makes him seem like he has bad character.
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I feel like the monster did kill his brother and Justine so I am also confused on why he didn’t want to hear him out when he could just go and kill other people he loves because Victor is so mean to him.
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Yes, but Victor may not be innocent this, but I don’t think he’s completely to blame, especially for the monster killing Wilhelm
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